July 15, 2021

The Power of Showing Up Confidently with Your Unique Voice and Message with Kate Dramis

The Power of Showing Up Confidently with Your Unique Voice and Message with Kate Dramis

Why does showing up online cause many of us to feel afraid? Why does “showing up” seem so scary? It's vulnerability. It’s the fear of letting people see the real you. It’s that fear that keeps you from growing and transforming more fully. It’s also the fear that makes you feel like you’re getting nothing done. 

In this episode, I’m going to introduce you to Kate Dramis, a copywriter and messaging coach who is obsessed with helping entrepreneurs find their voice, share their voice, and own their voice in the online space. 

She has written copy for multi-6 and 7-figure launches, helping some of the top thought leaders in the online space connect, grow, and convert their audience through engaging messaging and copy. She has coached hundreds of entrepreneurs on how to create authentic, engaging copy that grows their income and impact without having to sacrifice what makes them unique. 

Timestamps: 

[4:18] - An affinity for the written word

[5:25] - The common myths you keep telling yourself and your message

[6:42] - Ask these questions so you can get real with your fears

[10:14] - The relationship between confidence and competence 

[18:22] - Removing “Yeah, but…” statements from what you truly want in life

[23:50] - Making time versus filling time

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For more information on the Make Time for Success podcast, visit:

https://www.maketimeforsuccesspodcast.com

 

Connect with Us!

 

Dr. Christine Li -

Website: https://www.procrastinationcoach.com

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/procrastinationcoach

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/procrastinationcoach/


Kate Dramis -

Website: www.katedramis.com 

Instagram: www.instagram.com/katedramis

Facebook:  www.facebook.com/katedramis

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katedramis/

Kate’s Free Nurture Email Guide: https://www.maketimeforsuccesspodcast.com/email

Transcript

Christine Li:

Welcome back to the show. This is Episode 31. If you've ever wished that you could be a better communicator, where you could really express your full self and what you mean completely, then this episode is for you. My special guest to Kate ramus is not only a powerful copywriting coach to some of the most successful thought leaders and entrepreneurs in the online business world, but she is also gifted at showing others how to hone in on their true message, and how to express their true self. Kate is the founder of copy that converts her signature copywriting program. And she's also the host of amplified A F, a weekly Facebook Live show that helps entrepreneurs own their voice in the online space. So what do you say we get over some of our own communication and writing blocks by listening to this episode, shall we? But before we do, I want to mention that Kate has a free guide for you on how to craft your nurture email sequence. For those of you who are online entrepreneurs at make time for success podcast.com slash email. Again, it's a free downloadable guide on how to create a great nurture email sequence. And all you need to do to get that is go to make time for success podcast.com slash email. Let's go to the episode. Hi, I'm Dr. Christine Li and I'm a psychologist and a procrastination coach. I've helped 1000s of people move past procrastination and overwhelm so they can begin working to their potential. In this podcast, you're going to learn about powerful strategies for getting your mind, body and energy to work together so that you can focus on what's really important and accomplish the goals you want to achieve. When you start living within your full power, you're going to see how being productive can be easy, and how you can create success on demand. Welcome to the make time for success podcast. Hi, everyone. Welcome back to the show. Today I have the lovely and talented Kate ramus. On the show with me as my guest expert. She is a messaging and copywriting coach, a writer and a gifted leader of entrepreneurs who are interested in connecting with their audience in a closer more meaningful way, and for converting those relationships into more sales. So thank you, Kate, for being on the show with me today.

Kate Dramis:

Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here.

Christine Li:

Thank you so much. So can you describe to us what your journey has been? And what growth and what hurdles you might have had to face to get to where you are today?

Kate Dramis:

Yeah, absolutely. So I really fell into what I do as a copywriter, which is really just a fancy way of saying I help people like sound better, I'll take the brilliance in their head and communicate it better. But when I was in schools, I've been a writer forever. I've written fiction since I was 11. I love to write but I didn't really know that there was such thing as a copywriter, I had no idea until I was looking for a job. And I applied at an agency I actually applied for a PR role because I was like this place looks cool. I could do PR and they didn't have an open role. And they said, but we have a copywriting role we think you'd be a great fit for and I was like cool, what's the copywriter? And that's how I got into it. I literally just kind of stumbled into it and was freelancing on the side. And then if you years later turned around and my freelancing business was bigger than my corporate job. I was in corporate at the time. And I was like, Well, I guess it's time to take this full time and start coaching others on how to do this to

Christine Li:

what do you feel there is about you that makes you so good at copywriting. And please brag all you want because I want to hear what is your magic with words.

Kate Dramis:

My magic with words is I'm really good at communicating through the written word. I would actually say I haven't considered myself a really good verbal communicator. But like if I really have to get a message across, I have to write it first. That's how my brain works. And I also found that I'm a social chameleon. So I'm really good at like listening and then kind of mimicking back to someone what they're processing. And that has been my superpower in copywriting is that I'm able to sit there and like mirror you back to you.

Christine Li:

That is a gift. I think it's very akin to therapy. Being a therapist, I think serving as the mirror holding that person's energy and Kind of interpreting it for them so that they can be more themselves. So I love this. I love where we're going with this. Okay, so now, what have you noticed with your clients? I know that's a very broad statement. But what have you noticed have been the types of blocks or hesitations that you see most commonly? Oh,

Kate Dramis:

I love this question. So, specifically, in the coaching side of my business, when I'm coaching other entrepreneurs who maybe aren't ready to outsource their writing yet, and are still doing it themselves, one of the biggest things that I see in their way is it's not that they're not a good writer. And it's not that they don't know what they want to say, they just haven't given themselves permission to fully step into the message they really want to share. So I see most times when people are struggling with their messaging and coffee, it's either because they're trying to follow the quote, unquote, right way to do it. And so they're blocking their own unique voice, or they're scared of what's going to happen when they actually do show their true selves online. Because that can be really scary for people. You know, it's like, when we put out something, and people don't react well to it. Well, if it's not really you, then you don't have to take it personally. But when it's like, really you and your core message, then it's personal.

Christine Li:

No wonder we all feel that writing can be so difficult. Because you're trapped, no matter which way you put it out. So yes, what have been your signature techniques for allowing people to release the blocks to understand the blocks and to feel better about just putting things out there to share?

Kate Dramis:

Yeah, so one of the things that I do a lot with my clients is really just get to the heart of like, what is the block? Like? What is it that you're facing? Like, what is the fear, and then really walking them through, and giving them the support to go through that scenario, where they have someone in their back pocket to say, like, hey, look, it didn't turn out the way you were thinking it was gonna turn out or like, Look, it wasn't so bad, right. And I think a lot of times to just holding space for my clients to give themselves the permission to do things their way, a lot of times when my clients come to me, I'm the first person to tell them that they don't have to do something the way that they were told they had to do it in order for it to work. And so I love just holding space and listening and giving them that permission to give themselves that permission to say, hey, like what feels aligned to you and getting your message out there. What feels aligned to you and your launch strategy? How do you want to say this? And I think a lot of times people don't ask entrepreneurs that question.

Christine Li:

Okay. I agree with you, there are so many different models in the online space for what works, that it can be somewhat confining, I think, and there's so many different ways to say the same thing. And there's so many different ways of looking at things that we want to make sure to keep our eyes open, and our brains open for the funnest way to communicate things, the most energetic way to communicate things. So I appreciate your work and how you work with people on their fears. So can we shift to talking about your own journey a little bit more closely? In terms of how did you develop your own personal authority as the business leader, the guide, the person who can really can really show people the way? Did you have conflict over that?

Kate Dramis:

Yes, yes. And I think sometimes I still do To be honest, like, I think it's a, it's a constant journey, right? Every time we get to another level, there's another block that comes up that's like, Can I really do this? And who am I to do this? I would say that they have probably struggled with most Christine and I haven't actually talked to other people about this before, I don't think publicly is I came from an agency environment where my age was a problem. Like I was the leader, I was the department head. And it was constantly a point of I wouldn't even say contention, but it was referenced a lot in terms of like, well, you're really young to be you know, in this leadership role, and you're really young to be doing this. So I carried that baggage and that block over to my business as a business owner. I was you know, am was a young entrepreneur, whatever that even means, like, there's tons of people who were younger than me, and they were crushing it in our space. That was a block that I had to really overcome. Is that being a certain age or you know what it was like looking a certain way on camera and appearing a certain way? Like there is no right way to be a business leader and a leader in your space. It's like, do you lead with integrity? Do you know your stuff? Do you get people results? Those are the things that matter, but that was a big block for me for a long time.

Christine Li:

Okay, thank you for sharing that. And I did not know that that was the situation. Could you talk about conflict Dance, and how maybe your own confidence has expanded over time, but also, how you see people developing as they improve their writing skills. And as they improve their voice.

Kate Dramis:

Yeah. So I think confidence is one of those things where it's just exposure. And it's something that we can carry over from other experiences where we have felt competence, so we don't feel confident in one area, we can look to an area where we do feel confident, and chances are, it's because we've done the thing enough to be confident. So for me, competence is one of those muscles that just takes exercising. So it's like, you got to get out there and do the thing, and then do it again, and then do it again, and then do it again, to build that confidence. And I see that a lot with my clients and their messaging and copy, the more they get out there. And they share their message and they write and they share their message and they write, the more it just becomes second nature. And then they're not thinking about the fears related to it, they feel confident, especially when they have that clarity, right, when you know what you're saying what you're doing, you're more confident in it.

Christine Li:

Okay, now I'm going to do a follow up question, which is, there's the practice issue, which I do agree with you helps everything right practice never hurt. Anyone, I don't think except for me, playing piano when I was younger, but I think there's the other factor of, and you touched on it earlier, which is kind of putting your own unique ness into what you're producing, whether it's copy for an online launch, or an essay, or a diary entry or a wedding. What do you call those speeches? You know, when you're like the maid of honor those speeches, right? So how do you encourage people to find that unique voice, opened it up and put it in to actually say, I'm going to take the risk now and dive deeper? I'm going to be bolder here and braver?

Kate Dramis:

Yeah. So to me that really comes back to being centered on your mission and your vision and your why. So when you can anchor into why you're doing what you're doing, you're able to speak from a place that's so much deeper than the surface level, oh, I'm just going to talk about this thing, because I'm going to talk about this thing. Or, you know, I'm going to write this area, because I'm gonna write this diary entry or this essay, but when you really can anchor into like, what is the what is the fuel to your fire, like, what is fueling you to do the things that you're doing, that is inherently going to send for you on your mission. And that's very unique to you. So like, my mission, and the way I came into being an entrepreneur is very different from, you know, yours, probably or someone else's. And so and I can keep that vision, front and center, then the way I talk about things is just going to be inherently different because I'm pulling from my experience.

Christine Li:

Third, follow up question, same topic is, what are your theories about the forces that hold us back? That causes us to feel almost like we have to silence ourselves, essentially, from being unique from being an individual from being more prominent, or recognized or visible?

Kate Dramis:

Yeah, that's a great question. So I think there, you have different things to keep in mind when thinking about that is one, are there actual things in place that are holding you back? Because for some people, those are very real, like, you know, some people really do have ties in themselves and things that they feel like they can't share openly, without bringing danger to themselves. And so I think that's a very real consideration to think about, like, Are there things right as your personal safety and your emotional safety at risk? If so, then that's something to consider. On the other side of that, I think there is a element of wanting to be liked by everyone. That's just not possible. The issue I see a lot of people face is it's much more prevalent, I guess, I would say online, because you're putting yourself out to more people, most of us aren't like jumping into a room of you know, 10,000 and being like, Hey, here's my, you know, origin story. And here's my very vulnerable self. We're not doing that in person. But online, you have an audience of 1000s, which means you're opening yourself up to 1000s of opinions, on your journey on your perspectives. And that can be scary. And I think the way to anchor that is to think about is your why more powerful than the fear of criticism from people who probably aren't even a fit for you anyways, and don't need to be in your space.

Christine Li:

I love it. Thank you for describing all of those factors. You make me realize how I try not to think about the 1000s of people that might be listening. I think that helps to keep me safe in making sure that my voice is continuously growing and flowing. And it can be scary when you think about it. But I appreciate you using the word safety. Because I think we need to feel safe with our thoughts and our feelings before the words can really flow. And I hope that's the goal, or I think that's the goal is that that writing isn't a painful, awkward or foreign activity that it becomes something that is comfortable, personal, real, and flowing. So yeah, I certainly wish that for everyone who's listening for me too, and for you to Kate. So let's shift to maybe your wishes for the future for yourself and writing. I know you're working on a novel, would you want to talk about that?

Kate Dramis:

Sure. Yes. So this novel has been a very long time coming, this is actually probably the third novel that I've worked on. It's the first that's been so thoroughly developed. So it's gonna be a part of a three part fantasy series. It's completely different from anything I've ever done before. It's a different genre that I've ever written in. It's very different from my day job. But it is such fuel for my spirit, it is such fuel for even my business, because it's a totally different creative muscle for me. So yeah, I'm like, a third of the way done, and I'm really excited to get it finished.

Christine Li:

Great, great. Great. Is there a reason why you're choosing now to launch into this new journey? Was there a reason why it was now versus before or in the future?

Kate Dramis:

Um, you know, that's such a great question. I actually don't know, I think it was a little bit of divine timing, and that I had this space in, in my business. And like, finally had this the mental space to like, look outside of just what I was doing on a daily basis, I also think it was a little bit of part necessity, you know, within the last year, being at home all the time, it was really easy for me to be plugged into work all of the time. And, for me, I'm a big reader, that's kind of how I escape is I like to throw myself into, you know, fake worlds and fiction. And I realized that I had, I had this space, and this time to just really start creating and get serious about creating it. And once I made that decision, everything just sort of started aligning, where I found a coach to help me with it, I found some friends who are also working on novels, and we take time every quarter to go right. So it kind of just all came together. And it actually helped me decide where I want my business to go. Because I was like, I need more time to write. So let me restructure my business, I support my hobby.

Christine Li:

And are you surprised at how you can craft your life? How you, you know, you discussed how you started not knowing what copywriting was, and being in the agency structure to now writing novels and running your own business and running your own time? What are your reflections of on being able to do that for yourself? And how would you suggest to other people who are interested in making that kind of a shift? What would you tell them?

Kate Dramis:

Yeah, oh, my gosh, that's such a good question. Well, I am definitely I would say, I'm surprised at how quickly it all unfolded. I don't know that I'm necessarily like, there are moments where I'm surprised. But I, you know, it's I was actually just telling, I ran into a friend who knew me in the very beginning stages of my business. And it used to be like me working out of a Starbucks all the time. And like on my little baby laptop, and, you know, today I have a team I have, it's just it's so different. I have ample time to write like, they're all these different factors. And I'm surprised at how quickly they can come into place when you make a decision and you commit to the decision. And I think that would be my advice to anyone who's looking at their life. And they're saying, This isn't what I want. It's just to say, Okay, what do you want? And then start to remove the what I call a Yeah, but that we've put in the way, you know, a lot of times we say I want this Well, yeah, but and then we give ourselves a list of reasons why we can't have it. And are those actual reasons we can't have it? Or are there things that are actually are in our control for us to reshape and redefine so we can get what we want.

Christine Li:

That's the best description of self empowerment. I think. I've heard I think I, you've just reconfirmed your genius with the word. So thank you for sharing that. I'm going to repeat that. Basically, you want to hone in on what you really want. And I would add being really unabashed about it by just saying like, clearly this is what my heart is saying what my brain wants. What I've been dreaming about and what doesn't leave my mind, and then commit to it really say that this is going to be my focus, my mission, my path, and then removing anything that doesn't really fit in that scheme and making sure that your choices are meaningful from that point on. Yes, yes. Okay. Great. Love it. I love it, too. All right. So let's talk about empowerment. Because you've mentioned to me just before we pressed record, that you're wanting to expand into more of a coaching practice or broader coaching space, would you mind giving us your thoughts about what inspired that in you, and if you could share some tips for our audience, too.

Kate Dramis:

Yeah. So the vision of my brand has always been founded on empower of it, you know, empowering people to be their truest self to lead the life they want. And ultimately, the way in which I help people do that is through sharing their message and owning their voice and being able to articulate what they want to share with the world through copy. And I'm noticing the more I do this, the more I coach people, the more into really empowerment coaching, I kind of get into and coaching on removing the hurdles, etc. So my business has kind of always been on this trajectory, it just occurred to me recently that I've never created an actual offer around like, this is what we're going to do together. So I'm really, really excited about that. And I think that for a lot of people, our blocks that manifest and other areas of our lives really come down to these core areas. It's the self empowerment piece, it's Do you believe that you can get what you want and have the ability to go after it? Do you believe that you can have the confidence to be able to put yourself out there, and that ability, fuels, everything, everything?

Christine Li:

Dear listeners, you're not watching me on video, but my eyes went to the back of my head because in in kind of almost like a prayer position. When Kate said, Do you believe in your mission, and I just felt that so deeply, that you have to have the belief before anything can really get activated, and anything can take root and take hold. So that is a fantastic tip. And I'm hoping, you know, with this podcast, and with our individual work and low work of our colleagues that we are helping people to kind of deepen their belief in themselves, really, we each pick our own little slice of the content. But we're all out here because we just want people to find their better way, their stronger voice, their easier style, whether it's clothing or writing or how they get things done. And I think that's always fun and inspiring work because we get to see people really grow. So thank you so much for sharing all of the apps, is there anything you would want to share about making time for practicing? Let's say we've got lots of really busy listeners, people who are tired from the pandemic and from making it all work continuously? Is there a way that you know, to create time, either in the physical calendar or in your heart and mind? For extra writing or extra belief building?

Kate Dramis:

Yeah, so I live by my calendar. So I think blocking time is really important. I have time on my calendar. That is, I think making time is often mistaken with filling time. And the goal is not necessarily to fill it, it's to have it available. And I think to give yourself that option of Do you want to use it? Do you want to feel it? Do you want to put something in there where you could work on this? Or can you just give yourself the time. And I think that's the first step for a lot of people is oftentimes we don't even give ourselves the time. We don't create the time we feel every single second we have. I am. I am my quote unquote busy person. I used to identify with that very heavily. I was like, Oh, I'm always busy. I'm always busy. And so I need to do this for myself. Like I have to block out time. And so I think that's the first step is looking at your schedule and saying like when is non negotiable time for you? And you get to fill out the way you want it. But when is your non negotiable time for me? It's Mondays and Fridays. I do not take client meetings Mondays and Fridays. I don't unless there's like an emergency and I can't there's no other time. Because that time is for me to create. It's for me to think it's Nature rest, whatever I need to fuel my ultimate mission, I need to create time to do that.

Christine Li:

Thank you for that personal lesson, I need to try to start to do something like that with my own schedule and time blocking. I love it. And I think you were also communicating that we can use buisiness as a passive way of blocking our ability to grow. Because if we don't allow ourselves the time, how are the skills supposed to get strengthened? How are we supposed to recognize that we actually love this other stuff that we haven't been fitting in. So being responsible about time management is really great for success development and for vision development. And it's also just healthy. I agree with you that if you're going to run around busy all the time, I think the creativity might not be at its peak, because we're always running around and always feeling a little bit more spent. Maybe then we need to. So thank you. Yeah, thank ya. I love all the wisdom that you have shared, is there a final message you would want to leave our audience?

Kate Dramis:

Oh, I would just say I would just encourage you to get really clear on what your best life looks like. I think that is such a fun exercise. And if you need a virtual cheerleader, I'm here to remind you that you can do it. And you can go after it. So I would say that would be my last little piece.

Christine Li:

Okay, wonderful. So how can people stay in touch with you get in touch with you work with you be with you let us know.

Kate Dramis:

I am everywhere on the Internet at Kate dream is my main platform hub of connection is actually Instagram, I have a massive extrovert. So please come and say Hello, it's me, I will respond. I will probably send you pictures of my dogs will become besties. But that's the best way to get in touch with me.

Christine Li:

You can see Kate doing lots of dance parties on Instagram. They're super fun catering. This is Dr. a. m i s and also do have a free resource that you might want to share with our audience.

Kate Dramis:

Yeah, so for anyone in the you know, the marketing space, that online marketing space, I have a free guide to writing better emails, specifically nurture emails, so how to build your community and talk to your list. And that's a really simple guide that you can pick up.

Christine Li:

Do you happen to have the URL available? Okay, I know sorry. No worries. I surprised you with that question. So I will put that link in the opening comments and also in the show notes so that we can make sure that people can connect with you. Thank you so much for talking with me today. You're the best. I love you. And I wish you all the best. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. Thank you for listening to this episode of The make time for success podcast. If you enjoyed what you heard, you can subscribe to make sure you get notified of upcoming episodes. You can also visit our website make time for success podcast.com for past episodes, show notes and all the resources we mentioned on the show. Feel free to connect with me over on Instagram too. You can find me there under the name procrastination coach. Send me a DM and let me know what your thoughts are about the episodes you've been listening to. And let me know any topics that you might like me to talk about on the show. I'd love to hear all about how you're making time for success. Talk to you soon.

Kate Dramis

Copywriter & Messaging Coach

Kate is a copywriter and messaging coach who is obsessed with helping entrepreneurs find their voice, share their voice, and own their voice in the online space.

She has written copy for multi-6 and 7-figure launches, helping some of the top thought leaders in the online space connect, grow, and convert their audience through engaging messaging and copy. She has coached hundreds of entrepreneurs on how to create authentic, engaging copy that grows their income and impact without having to sacrifice what makes them unique.

Kate is also the founder of Copy That Converts, her signature copywriting program, and the host of Amplified AF, a weekly Facebook Live show that helps entrepreneurs own their voice in the online space.